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Post by rose35 on Dec 8, 2009 19:26:04 GMT -5
Hi All! Tonight we are rewatching/discussing a classic ML episode! I know alot of you have copies now of the script,wish i could have bought one too! Should be interesting to see if they are differant scripts from each others. I do not have any questions to start off but thought i'd open up the thread. I've been Xmas shopping and other stuff today and am now off to sit down to dinner. So please whoever would like to start us off with 1 ,2 or many questions feel free to do so! ENJOY! See ya all later!
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 8, 2009 20:02:41 GMT -5
Well, I'll throw this out there:
How do the dreams in this episode resemble dream sequences in other episodes, i.e., "Big Man...", "Man Who Cried Wife", "It's a Wonderful Job" to name a few.
For those that have a script, what is one thing that stands out the most that is different from what aired? Care to share for those that didn't have a chance to get their hands on one?
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Post by jpen on Dec 8, 2009 20:08:14 GMT -5
Well, this one is such a visual feast that I'm not even sure I can analyze it...but here are a few questions that popped into my noggin:
1. This episode is a sort of love letter to two different 40s film styles: the polished, MGM-style of Maddie's dream, and the gritter "film noir" look of David's. a) For anyone who caught this episode back in '85: what was your reaction? b) Do you have a preference for either sequence? c) How is Maddie's personality reflected in her dream, and David's in his?
2. David accuses Maddie of appointing herself "guardian for her whole damn sex." Where do you think this comment is coming from? And do you see David doing the same thing?
3. Why is Maddie so furious at David calling her a sexist?
Gotta run for now...see y'all later! ;D
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Post by diane on Dec 8, 2009 20:11:27 GMT -5
I am way behind......haven't even watched yet.
Starting in a few minutes......hopefully I'll be in around 9:30.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 20:18:50 GMT -5
How do the dreams in this episode resemble dream sequences in other episodes, i.e., "Big Man...", "Man Who Cried Wife", "It's a Wonderful Job" to name a few.
I think the dreams allow us to peer beneath the veneer (hey, that rhymes) and get to really understand the characters...what their true viewpoints are, without the facade. Additionally, as the dreams play out, we get to see another side of our friends, their wants and desires that cannot, for one reason or another, be fulfilled...at least not yet.
For those that have a script, what is one thing that stands out the most that is different from what aired? Care to share for those that didn't have a chance to get their hands on one?
I think the script version I have plays out pretty close to the aired episode. There are some differences in the car scene and a large difference near the end of Maddie's dream, after the detective leaves Rita's apartment. The scene centers on Rita and Zach plotting to keep their story straight in the face of the investigation.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 20:34:07 GMT -5
1. This episode is a sort of love letter to two different 40s film styles: the polished, MGM-style of Maddie's dream, and the grittier "film noir" look of David's.
a) For anyone who caught this episode back in '85: what was your reaction?
I thought it was spectacular. A wonderful and imaginative way to bring together so many different genres and weave them together in a fun filled 60 minute ride. It has EVERYTHING...Orson Wells, big band numbers, snappy dialogue, Cybill in various states of undress....imagining the requiting of unrequited love...what else can you ask for!
b) Do you have a preference for either sequence? I think they were both super. Maddie's was more glamorous and straight forward while Dave's, true to form, was more rollicking and chock full of jokes and double entendres.
c) How is Maddie's personality reflected in her dream, and David's in his? Maddie's Rita played by the rules and was a loving and devoted partner until corrupted by that evil Zach. (Although it didn't take much to corrupt her, eh?). Maddie's Zach just played her like a fiddle and used her. On the other hand, David's Zach initially thought of Rita as a sparring partner, somebody BETTER than her husband, somebody would make a better fit with him. He was smitten and took a bit longer to come around to the nefarious deed to follow.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 20:40:44 GMT -5
2. David accuses Maddie of appointing herself "guardian for her whole damn sex." Where do you think this comment is coming from? And do you see David doing the same thing?
Well Maddie is, at last check, a woman and obviously would see things from a woman's point of view. Same with Dave. Now BOTH of them say that they look at things from a purely neutral vantage point, but we all know that isn't true. We ALL see things through the prism of our own backgrounds, upbringing and experiences. As we gain wisdom, we try to understand another's opinions, but can we ever be truly free from at least SOME bias?
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 20:41:27 GMT -5
3. Why is Maddie so furious at David calling her a sexist?
I think because Dave took away her "sexist". She sees DAVE as one, and him using that term on her seems preposterous. To Maddie, only MEN can be sexist...not ladies.
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 8, 2009 20:56:29 GMT -5
How do the dreams in this episode differ from dream sequences in other episodes?
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 21:08:14 GMT -5
How do the dreams in this episode differ from dream sequences in other episodes? I think it is because we get to compare and contrast the same data processed through different brain housing units. David and Maddie came upon the same information at about the same time (Okay, so Dave 'heard' about the murder some years before, but he wasn't "up" on it before this meeting.) Neither one had any evidence about the case that the other didn't have, so they were starting from the same point. It was how we see they are BOTH a bit sexist, through their dreams, that reinforces what we already know about them, and sets the stage for the continuing battle. Other dream sequences were mostly through the eyes of one person..Maddie for example in Wonderful Job and Big Man..David with the Claymation phones...the student with Atomic Shakespeare.
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Post by jpen on Dec 8, 2009 21:14:37 GMT -5
Gray, may I just say...you're looking VERY dapper in that avatar, my friend! Rita must be weak in the knees! ;D
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 8, 2009 21:22:47 GMT -5
Gray, may I just say...you're looking VERY dapper in that avatar, my friend! Rita must be weak in the knees! ;D Why thank you my dear. I did spend a tad more time on this one, thinking that my favorite episode of all time deserves my best work. I can always remember that scene....if I wasn't totally smitten for her before, that one sealed the deal.
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 8, 2009 22:02:45 GMT -5
2. David accuses Maddie of appointing herself "guardian for her whole damn sex." Where do you think this comment is coming from? And do you see David doing the same thing? I've been whirling this one for a while... I believe David has a fairly sound reason for calling her a guardian of her whole sex. He has learned in the time they have worked together that she is very opinionated when it comes to things like extra-marital affairs (Next Murder...), women in the work force (Money Talks...). And they haven't even gotten to Man Who Cried..., Atomic... As far as David doing the same thing...well, he always seems to have a comeback for most of what Maddie has ever shared in any kind of serious discussion they have had thus far, especially in this episode. I would say he usually defends his whole damn sex!! Gray...that avatar is perfect!!
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Post by diane on Dec 8, 2009 22:03:05 GMT -5
Before starting on the analysis......just gotta say I really do think this is the very best episode of Moonlighting....in every way...the writing, the acting, the technical aspects. And although it is not my favorite, it's definitely in my top 5.
As those of you with scripts will notice....there are very few changes from the script to what was aired -- in my opinion, because it was written by my favorite ML writer, Debra Frank and her writing partner Carl Sautter. (For those of you aspiring script writers....Mr. Sautter wrote a great book on that very art!!) My copy of the Dream Sequence script is signed by Debra and Carl....and for that, I am most grateful!
I love to poke through and analyze, but I just really needed to give kudos to an episode that I believe is a true television classic.
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Post by diane on Dec 8, 2009 22:14:59 GMT -5
How do the dreams in this episode resemble dream sequences in other episodes, i.e., "Big Man...", "Man Who Cried Wife", "It's a Wonderful Job" to name a few.
These dream sequences are truly stand alone pieces, done amazingly well, with supreme attention to detail. And in spite of the fact that D&M are playing very different characters, their individual dream sequences reflect their "real" characters.....Maddie's cooler, more understated, while David's is more base, sexy, and wisecracking.....
They both also include amazing kisses....my preference as the best kiss of the series being the one in David's dream by the window. And as Gray did with his.....think I went to sleep at night more than once with that baby tucked under my pillow!!
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