graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Feb 10, 2009 20:16:38 GMT -5
7. There is no question that can do justice to David's declaration on the plane. Just tell us what you absolutely loved about it.
It contained just about everything I wanted to say for the past two seasons. He discussed his true unvarnished truth about Maddie, the trials he went through and yet said he'd do anything for her.
And I LOVED it when he said that he was through...that she now had to come to him.
Absolutely Bruce's best acting job of the entire series...and maybe his entire career. Good job Bruno.
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Post by lin212 on Feb 10, 2009 20:18:53 GMT -5
3. Is David a father figure to the office staff?
By this point, David definitely seemed to be a father figure. Agnes and Bert were so relieved when David returned. They felt that he was going to take care of everything. At the end, David gave his pep talk to the entire staff and tried to restore peace and harmony between MacGillicuddy and Viola. He took charge of the situation.
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Post by manitobadesigner on Feb 10, 2009 20:19:25 GMT -5
Hey peeps! I'm very much enjoying everyone's responses thus far.
2. From the expanding packet of popcorn in the beginning, we know the news of Maddie's pregnancy is going to "pop". What is your feeling about her parents' reactions? Do you feel she herself has come to grips with the pregnancy yet?
I think her mother was very sympathetic and supportive, and she was tamping down her curiosity quite well at this point. She is rightly concerned that her adult daughter is hiding in her house, and she darn well knows that there's something more Maddie's hiding from than just stress. The way Mrs. Hayes expresses this is consistently in a knowing fashion, she totally suspects that David is involved but doesn't slam Maddie over the head with it. Alex's reaction on the other hand is supportive yet has the flavour of a father who's just found out his daughter's been knocked up and is about to go after the guy with a shotgun.
Definitely a big fat no on this one. I think she's still floating around in denial. She wasn't even making any progress with coming to terms with her relationship with David, let alone this surprise. I had thought to myself at the time this episode aired, "Oh well, I guess she's going to be staying there for a couple of years now!"
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
|
Post by graycav56 on Feb 10, 2009 20:21:57 GMT -5
8. What do you think would have been different had Maddie been a fly on the wall in that plane?
Well we sure as hell wouldn't have had any WALTER BISHOP!!
I personally thought that Alex would have found a way to get the meat of this conversation with David into that honey blonde noggin of hers. Alex knew that the best thing for his daughter was to get her hooked up with the father of her baby and I think that would have been a priority for him.
Too bad it didn't pan out....for all of us.
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 20:21:34 GMT -5
2. From the expanding packet of popcorn in the beginning, we know the news of Maddie's pregnancy is going to "pop". What is your feeling about her parents' reactions? Do you feel she herself has come to grips with the pregnancy yet?
Her parent's are obviously excited about her pregnancy, but very worried about how Maddie is handling it. Mrs. Hayes has her motherly suspicions from the get go. And Mr. Hayes just knows she is acting "odd"!
As far as Maddie coming to grips with it, I believe she is somewhat relieved after she tells her mother, but REALLY relieved after her father is told and she realizes she did not disappoint him. Even at 36 years old, no one really likes to disappoint their parents. And Maddie is a Daddy's girl!!
I do agree with manitoba-----she has not fully come to terms with the whole situation. And I think this is understandable. She isn't sure who the father is at this point. There are a billion things going through that honeyblonde noggin of hers! ......Sam is gone.....but I love David.........will he feel trapped and obligated.......will he still love me.........just to name a few!
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 20:26:03 GMT -5
3. Is David a "father figure" to the office staff? How do you interpret their reactions in this episode?
Yes, he is absolutely the father figure, but the kind of father that really does not like to lay the law down when it is needed and is usually in the middle of children's mischief!! ;D
They are waiting for him to come back and take charge of the situation and David does not disappoint. However, I think McGuillacuddy could have used a few swats or at least a few laps around the office for that sassy attitude look on his face!! ;D
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Post by manitobadesigner on Feb 10, 2009 20:29:27 GMT -5
I REALLY liked this comment from lin
Mr. Hayes comes to learn of David's deep love for Maddie and the heartache that he has endured. I believe that this discovery puts David in a new light in Mr. Hayes' eyes. He has earned a new respect for David.
As for David, I believe that he comes to know himself and how much he wants to be the father of this child
I think that David really got so much out of talking with Mr. Hayes - not only a way to vent his bottled up emotions, but also the advice from a man who's raised a child already ("..it's NEVER over."). It's almost like everything sort of coalesced for David at that moment, where you knew he wasn't going to turn back - his commitment was expressed and iron-clad.
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Post by lin212 on Feb 10, 2009 20:32:31 GMT -5
8. What do you think would have been different if Maddie had been a fly on the wall in that plane? Agree with graycav on this one - no Walter Bishop. I believe that if Maddie had seen the raw pain in David's eyes, she finally would have understood. She would have known that she had nothing to fear and that David was ready to take care of her and the baby.
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 20:36:26 GMT -5
8. David says, "When it comes to this whole mess, we've got a dead heat between things I've done wrong and things I've done right." I think at the same time, throughout the whole series, we have a huge contrast between what we as the audience get to see of David, and what is actually revealed to Maddie. What do you think would have been different had Maddie been a fly on the wall in that plane?
Agree with Brother Gray. If Maddie could have heard those words I think she would have come back immediately and there would be no little Walter!! If only David could have given part of that speech in the laundry mat........
But, the fact that we see more of David's character growth throughout the series than Maddie does is exactly what kept (or keeps) us coming back for more! It really was genius writing despite our anxieties over their relationship!
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Post by lin212 on Feb 10, 2009 20:38:49 GMT -5
5. In a previous episode, Mrs. Hayes described Maddie as her father's daughter. What in the way that Mr. Hayes handled this situation reminded you of Maddie? So funny that you asked this...as soon as Mr. Hayes walks into David's office, I realized he had become a kind of Maddie-by-proxy. He doesn't let David snow him, and matches him quip for quip; it's like a platonic David-and-Maddie banter. In the restaurant, he makes some pretty enormous assumptions (if Maddie won't talk to him, how could he know with any certainty that David is the father?) and then he runs right over David in their conversation, just as Maddie (bless her heart!) has been known to do (most significantly in her office in IACM). And then, of course, there's "the ol' Hayes backside" on the plane... But also, Mr. Hayes is acting out of love for his daughter--he is fiercely protective of her, in the same way that Maddie is protective of her mother in "Every Father's Daughter." In fact, Mr. Hayes' conversation with David in the restaurant is almost the verbal equivalent of the "clutch assault" in that earlier episode. Even so, Mr. Hayes eventually lets David have his say--and admits that he was wrong. Maddie does the same in MHGM, and also in "Flesh Made Word" when she hears David out. They're both stubborn, but eventually they come around. So, Maddie's dad might come off as stern and gruff, but he has a huge heart...just like our Ms. Hayes. Jpen nailed this one for me - my sentiments exactly.
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 20:42:14 GMT -5
5. In a previous episode, Mrs. Hayes described Maddie as her father's daughter. What in the way that Mr. Hayes handled this situation reminded you of Maddie?
Oh, Maddie is DEFINITELY her father's daughter. The way Mr. Hayes did not want to discuss anything but what he thought was the only way to handle the situation, assuming that he knew all there was to know AND if he had been 20 years younger, he probably would have belted David just like Maddie gave it to him with the slaps in IAC.....M and like the purse pelting in EDFIAV!!
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Feb 10, 2009 20:45:47 GMT -5
I just reread a post I put in the episode discussion thread and find it very appropriate here.
When I first watched this on ABC, I viewed it entirely through the eyes of David. Now over 20 years later, I find myself seeing myself more as Alexander Hayes. Amazing what time will do.
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 20:59:00 GMT -5
4. Bert and Agnes play small but pivotal roles in this episode. How would you describe their roles in the Blue Moon family? I just love Agnes. She is the smartest one of all of them!! Her riding on Maddie's desk as they cart it out of the office says a thousand things, don't you think? Forever loyal to Blue Moon, a kindred spirit, and is willing to literally knock some sense into David when needed! David and Maddie, in many ways, owe her big time!! And Bert? He does what Bert does. Takes the role of acting head detective very seriously----desk inspections and all---only to fulfill his role as he thinks David would want him to!! But Bert and Agnes's role runs much deeper that office supplies and message machines. They act as we wish David and Maddie would be, only not as "geeky"!! They have relationship stuff figured out and make it look so easy......
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Post by beesnbears on Feb 10, 2009 21:03:18 GMT -5
I REALLY liked this comment from linMr. Hayes comes to learn of David's deep love for Maddie and the heartache that he has endured. I believe that this discovery puts David in a new light in Mr. Hayes' eyes. He has earned a new respect for David.
As for David, I believe that he comes to know himself and how much he wants to be the father of this childI think that David really got so much out of talking with Mr. Hayes - not only a way to vent his bottled up emotions, but also the advice from a man who's raised a child already ("..it's NEVER over."). It's almost like everything sort of coalesced for David at that moment, where you knew he wasn't going to turn back - his commitment was expressed and iron-clad. That's right manitoba---it's NEVER over. I thought the same thing when Mr. Hayes said this to DAvid. What he was really telling David, besides child raising never being over, is that " if you love someone as much as you just confessed to me, it is never over." "It's all academic".
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Post by lin212 on Feb 10, 2009 21:03:42 GMT -5
7. David's declaration on the plane -
I too feel that this was the most amazing scene ever. I love how David refused to be deterred by Mr. Hayes' attempts to walk away and not hear him out. David took control of the situation and faced him man to man, standing tall to defend himself. David had reached rock bottom. Blue Moon had collapsed. Agnes refused to comfort him and, instead, blamed him for all the havoc in the office. David was drowning in failure, but rose up to set the record straight. If he had to bare his soul, then so be it. We know that this was not an easy thing for David to do.
Finally, kudos to Bruce. His performance was nothing short of breath-taking.
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