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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:04:23 GMT -5
4.What is your take on the Nanny For Hire business? Do you feel that this was out of character for David at this point in the show? No not at all, it is the essence of David. It's what I (we) love about his personality. (I know my answers are uncharacteristically short but this is a process for me...I almost cried when I read "Baby Love" at the beginning of the review questions, lol...I'm too 'essed right now)
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Post by rose35 on Apr 28, 2009 22:08:09 GMT -5
6. Do you believe Maddie and David are “together”? Why or why not? (Yeah, I stole this one from the old thread, but it’s still a good question!) Well i do and i dont, some scenes in this episode you can say maybe yeah they are and they are continuing to work on it and that the baby being born wll bring them even closer. The scene of them on the couch together is so sweet, the way they look at each other, the way he places his hand on her stomach and then feels the baby kick,it was a big bonding moment for them , and yes the scene of them dancing as they look at each other and hold on to each other is very intimate too. You feel all mushy inside and then it all ends very quickly I guess since we dont see more of that togetherness it just leaves you to wonder what went on. I know things couldnt have been all perfect and happy and rosey but after all that time of waiting ,us the audience wanted it all for their characters! Ok i need some new FANFIC to read!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:08:43 GMT -5
6. Do you believe Maddie and David are “together”? Why or why not? (Yeah, I stole this one from the old thread, but it’s still a good question!) I always believed Maddie and David were together, no doubt about it. Yes it was strained but it was natural, IMO, they were together before they admitted the interest of being together. The words always got in M & D's way...their every day life together was enough to see they wanted the best for one another.
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Post by beesnbears on Apr 28, 2009 22:14:43 GMT -5
As far as them being together, I believe they are because of the nanny discussion in the office and the way they look at each other, the way they look at each other while dancing and the way they are in the hospital later. We may not see everything we want to see, at least I don't, but they still seemed engaged in a relationship. It is still, to this day, heartbreaking to hear Maddie questioning whether they will survive their loss: “I don’t think Ill ever be the same. I don’t think we will ever be the same.” And for her need to hear David's reassurance: “We’ll be alright. And you’re gonna be alright.” Not once, but twice: “Its gonna be hard to leave. Alone.” “You’re not gonna be alone. I’m gonna be right here with you. I’m not going anywhere.” And that is why I have always felt they were together....until "Between a Yuk..."
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:19:28 GMT -5
7. a) What are your thoughts as to why the writers wrote this episode as they did? b) What’s with the musical number at the end? Is it comic relief or just a way to fill some time in the episode? c) Do you believe that had GGC still been an active writer in Season 5 that Maddie and David’s relationship would have survived the loss of their baby? d) Did you watch the commentary? Did it help you make any sense out of some of their choices? Let me say first, thanks Bees and anyone who assisted with the questions. This 7th question is a doosy, I'll do my best to be PC. a) Not to sound too deep but it was like a prophecy; Glenn was sending a message to the network. ML was his baby and before he let anyone destroy his creative work he'd do it himself; kind of, I brought you in this world and I'll take you out. (I may have some hate mail after that but I can take the licks... too much symbolism here and I can & will explain my point of view) b) The musical number to me was a grand exit, a celebration of moving on to new things and new experiences. I believe it was a message to his writing staff and actors, it was Glenn's good bye. c) Yes but IMHO, the baby would have never been lost if Glenn wasn't leaving the show. I feel he saw the writing on the wall. d) I watched the commentary and the only thing I hear is regret and even a personal question of "why"; he truly is the only one who knows his motives and it bothers him. Alright, ready for the back lash
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:26:13 GMT -5
Wow, bees, great Qs! I really have to scratch my noggin' on these. While I won't jump to #7, I have to jump to #4 - the Nanny for Hire because this whole scene always bothered me. I think it is absolutely out of character for David at this point. All through S4, he is pining over Maddie, willing to give up his life for her, etc. In the finale, they finally come to an understanding and we are left with the hope that they are together. In the Nanny scene, David and Maddie don't feel like a couple to me. He seems like a friend who is trying to help her out. The David of S4 wouldn't have been ogling those girls - he only had eyes for Maddie. In this episode there is very little of D/M together, so it is a shame that this scene was wasted (IMHO). Don't get me wrong, the dialog was funny, but it's not what I wanted at this point. IMO, David is putting up a front and I believe he's attempting to get a reaction from Maddie. He knew that would bite her butt, he knew she would react. I think he did this and a lot of "stew pid" things because of all he went through in S4: David had subtle ways of poking at Maddie to get the attention she wasn't giving him in the relationship.
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Post by rose35 on Apr 28, 2009 22:28:33 GMT -5
It is still, to this day, heartbreaking to hear Maddie questioning whether they will survive their loss: “I don’t think Ill ever be the same. I don’t think we will ever be the same.” And for her need to hear David's reassurance: “We’ll be alright. And you’re gonna be alright.” Not once, but twice: “Its gonna be hard to leave. Alone.” “You’re not gonna be alone. I’m gonna be right here with you. I’m not going anywhere.” And that is why I have always felt they were together....until "Between a Yuk..." I so know what you mean about this scene , it is heartbreaking too see and hear Maddie voice these lines, did she think with the baby gone David would turn away from her? David told her she wasnt going to be alone. but then we do find out the very next episode that David obviously didnt stick around to help her through this from what we are told and they went off alone to deal with it. I know people deal with things differently but due to the conversation at the end of WOMB you think he should have tried to help her and they should have showed more of that
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Post by beesnbears on Apr 28, 2009 22:28:43 GMT -5
7. a) What are your thoughts as to why the writers wrote this episode as they did? b) What’s with the musical number at the end? Is it comic relief or just a way to fill some time in the episode? c) Do you believe that had GGC still been an active writer in Season 5 that Maddie and David’s relationship would have survived the loss of their baby? d) Did you watch the commentary? Did it help you make any sense out of some of their choices? Let me say first, thanks Bees and anyone who assisted with the questions. This 7th question is a doosy, I'll do my best to be PC. a) Not to sound too deep but it was like a prophecy; Glenn was sending a message to the network. ML was his baby and before he let anyone destroy his creative work he'd do it himself; kind of, I brought you in this world and I'll take you out. (I may have some hate mail after that but I can take the licks... too much symbolism here and I can & will explain my point of view) b) The musical number to me was a grand exit, a celebration of moving on to new things and new experiences. I believe it was a message to his writing staff and actors, it was Glenn's good bye. c) Yes but IMHO, the baby would have never been lost if Glenn wasn't leaving the show. I feel he saw the writing on the wall. d) I watched the commentary and the only thing I hear is regret and even a personal question of "why"; he truly is the only one who knows his motives and it bothers him. Alright, ready for the back lash I agree since!! Glenn does have some memory lapse in the commentary and it is mentioned that Chick Eglee also contributed, but it does seem as if Glenn had more to do with the majority of the episode. I would be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and say he would not have allowed the loss of the baby had he known that he would be back for the rest of the show. No one but Glenn could have written: “an extraordinary woman, bright, beautiful, a huge heart, though often times she pays it little heed. It’s the creators’ hope that your arrival will help amend this situation.” OR: “He has an extraordinary passion for life and an extraordinary passion for you mother.”
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:31:02 GMT -5
And Bruce was a delight as Baby Hayes. You gotta give the guy big-time kudos for being willing to play a role at the opposite end of the spectrum from an action hero! Absolutely! Bruce pulled off a FANTASTIC performance here. He not only proved he was a good sport, but made it absolutely believable. Bravo indeed to Bruno. Yes, especially when in Maddie's office and he was chewing the desk ornaments, great stuff.
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Post by diane on Apr 28, 2009 22:33:48 GMT -5
Hi all!
I honestly feel I may have overdosed with this episode today.....remembered some things I liked and some I very clearly did not.
But, let's get to the questions:
Before we see Baby Hayes there are clues as to who the father is at the beginning of this episode. What are they?
Sorry, Bees, I didn't pick up anything prior to actually seeing Baby Hayes. I didn't think it was at all unusual to have Maddie listening to and singing along with the Supremes...something you might find on a pop or easy listening station.
I do know, back in 1988, my heart leapt for joy when I saw Bruce in the diaper.......confirming David's fatherhood!
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:36:49 GMT -5
#6 - Do you believe that Maddie and David are still together? Why or why not? For me, I guess this goes back to the earlier question about the Nanny for Hire scene. They do not feel like a couple here. Also, at the end of S4, I imagined that, going forward, David would be spending time at Maddie's place. BUT in the opening scene in bed, she is obviously alone. They arrive at work separately. Maddie goes to lunch alone. There is really nothing very intimate in their conversation in the office. If it weren't for Maddie wrapping her arms around David's neck and giving him that look during the dance, there would be no inkling of the depth of their relationship. It's not until the tag, that we see them as a couple. David is worried about her, he is holding her hand, he says that they are going to be OK. Yet even here, Maddie says that it is going to be hard to go home alone. Obviously, she has no expectation that David is going to stick around now that the baby is gone. He reassures her that he is not going anywhere. And the final words by Dr. Weed telling them that they can try again real soon...it's as if they beginning and end of this episode were written by two different people. I know that both Glenn and Chick Eglee worked on this one - is it that simple? I didn't see it that way. One part I remember, Baby Hayes and Jerome were in the office after the argument and David came in behind Maddie. When they sat on the couch and David placed his hand on Maddie's belly and she placed her hand on top of his. They didn't say anything and that's what I saw (what I see), when the words didn't get in the way; D & M were together.
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Post by diane on Apr 28, 2009 22:38:51 GMT -5
2. What do you believe is the purpose of showing Baby Hayes the good and the bad parts of the world in which he will enter?
If the premise is that the emissary is to prepare the baby for what comes, he needs to provide the whole picture.
I love the montages....I thought at first they were personal choices of Glenn and Chick.........perhaps Jay. But from the commentary, I got the impression that many of the ML staff got to participate in choosing, clearing, or incorporating the scenes. I like that it became a group effort, and it probably is much more well rounded that way.
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Post by rose35 on Apr 28, 2009 22:39:59 GMT -5
Yes, especially when in Maddie's office and he was chewing the desk ornaments, great stuff. ROFLMAO! Yes he was awesome!
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:41:52 GMT -5
Ok, here is what I am thinking....and I could be wrong ...or making stuff up!! When Maddie wakes up we see a foot of the bed shot of her huge belly and there is harmonica music playing, but it sounds like "Maddie music". A harmonica playing has ALWAYS been "David music"!! In the car, she is listening to something David would be playing on the radio. When have we ever seen or heard Maddie play David's music in the BMW much less singing!! And in the commentary, JD says that the script called for specific music, almost like that had never been done before. That had to be Glenn's touch. Bees you are a M-A-S-T-E-R, excellent...so true! Wow ;D
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Post by sinceifell4u on Apr 28, 2009 22:43:33 GMT -5
LOL! It probably sounds like I am grasping for straws, but when there isn't anything else you start grabbing straws... Music was very important to Glenn and I have always loved thinking about the music choices through the whole show. Now about the Nanny Business.... ya'll don't get mad at me, but I have always thought that scene was funny and I think that it shows that David is still the David we all fell in love with...well maybe not gray, but he knows what I mean! I think his character has definitely grown because of his love for Maddie, but David is still David! He does admit that he went a little overboard and Maddie even concedes she may have been a little sensitive to it all. They share a really nice moment on the couch that makes me forgive David! I ain't mad at all Bees, I totally agree...1000%
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