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Post by beesnbears on Nov 3, 2009 20:45:54 GMT -5
1. At the beginning of the episode, what do you think is the state of mind of each of the characters......Maddie....David....Sam?
Maddie: Very confused, yet seems to understand what she is up against while chatting with Agnes. What happened to her frame of mind between the kiss on the trunk and the next morning in the office? David didn't tell her what she needed to hear. Instead, she decided to go chase the bad guys in a milk truck....sigh... She also seems afraid to face Sam when she sneaks back in her house.
David: He is very angry that Maddie came to his apt., shared a kiss and her feelings...somewhat...and then didn't tell him that Sam proposed. Frankly, I can understand why he flips out in the office and then clams up when pressed by Maddie. He wants to know what happened between the kiss on the trunk and the next morning as well! Dave, you shoulda' told her what she needed to know...
Sam: He is irritated that Maddie snuck out, annoyed that she hasn't said yes to his propsal and struck with the realization that DAvid actually has a shot at winning Maddie. And I don't feel sorry for him one bit!
2. Does Sam believe Maddie's story about where she was the night before? I think he WANTS to believe it, but knows she was with David for other reasons. How could he believe her? She doesn't even look him in the eye when she lies to him!! ;D
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 20:51:47 GMT -5
9. Bruce has remarked in an interview that during the final bed scene, David says, "I love you, Maddie." Big question.......can you see it? Does it make a difference to you?
Yes, I can see it, but it's hard because Cybill's hand is on Bruce's cheek. Does it make a difference? Yeah, to me it does.
All up until now Dave was adamant that he did NOT have to make a verbal statement...that his deeds proved his love for Maddie. Dave also, by now has gotten it through his thick skull that hearing those words are indeed important to her, and he finally reciprocates. Yea she said she loved him when she thought she was talking to Sam but the fact remains it came out of her larynx.
Finally, in the sack, they are even...they have both shown their love by their deeds, spoken their love through their words and are about to consummate their love...off camera of course. Darned PG rated networks.
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graycav56
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I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:00:38 GMT -5
2. Does Sam believe Maddie's story about where she was the night before? I think Sam believes that she was working on the Johnson case, but knows that Maddie isn't telling him the whole truth. At this point, Sam doesn't want to start an argument and risk pushing Maddie away. So, he decides to pretend to buy her story and tries to prove what a great guy he is...breakfast, bed tuck, etc. He was playing the kind, understanding - "how can you not pick me?" guy. I agree lin. He'll buy the case bit, but he knows she's gallivanting around with Dave but doesn't want to push it at this point.
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Post by beesnbears on Nov 3, 2009 21:07:13 GMT -5
3. I posted the original script scene at David's apartment. After reading this, there are a few questions: ~ Is Bruce's performance more effective the way it was aired or would you prefer it the way it was written?I think so...even more now that I've read the script. He conveys, by his look, coolness, silence...most of the things that are written. Just unbelievable! ~Does the scene as written change or support your original opinion about Sam? Completely supports it. I knew there were other reasons I didn't like him. There are some mean and hurtful things written here! And he physically pushes David back on the bed! I'm really glad they didn't show that because I would have broken our new 27inch TV back then!! The written version really shows where his heart is, I think....that his heart is not entirely tied to Maddie's happiness, but more to who can win the girl. And he seems so driven to win Maddie... ~How does this written scene affect your understanding of David's reaction to Maddie the next morning?Well, it may a little, but someone who watched the show and knew the characters like we know them would be able to understand what is going through his mind during that scene....I think... These were great great questions!
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Post by lin212 on Nov 3, 2009 21:09:58 GMT -5
3. I posted the original script scene at David's apartment. After reading this, there are a few questions: ~ Is Bruce's performance more effective the way it was aired or would you prefer it the way it was written? ~Does the scene as written change or support your original opinion about Sam? ~How does this written scene affect your understanding of David's reaction to Maddie the next morning? ~ We know that Bruce felt strongly that David's silence would demonstrate his strength and therefore fought for the version as filmed. He has a point. David's decision not to verbally engage Sam does diminish Sam to a great extent. It gives David the appearance of superiority. That said, there is a part of me that would love to see the banter between Sam and Dave. ~ I think that the original version shows Sam's true colors more than the filmed version. In the script, Sam pushes David back - definitely more menacing. As for the dialog, I noticed a significant difference near the end. On screen, Sam tells David that he should tell Maddie if he doesn't really care about her, but if he does, then he should tell her that too. That never really made sense to me. In the script, he starts off, but then just says that he knows who and what is best for her. He never encourages David to tell Maddie that he loves her. And then the final bit of hubris in the script - he tells David that he can never win. UGH! ~ I think David felt pretty confident after the kiss on the trunk and their conversation when leaving the bowling alley. Maddie said what a good time she had. So, Sam's visit and his revelation of the proposal confused David. I think that Sam appeared to have the upper hand in the scripted version more than the filmed version. He seemed to be pretty certain that Maddie would never pick David in the end - which blew David away after the events of the night before. He really felt that Maddie was playing him.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:10:05 GMT -5
3. I posted the original script scene at David's apartment. After reading this, there are a few questions:
~ Is Bruce's performance more effective the way it was aired or would you prefer it the way it was written?
Oh, I like it the way it was shot. His silence spoke volumes.
~Does the scene as written change or support your original opinion about Sam?
Sam was a bit more of, well, a prick in the written text. Especially the part where he encouraged David to tell Maddie how he feels. In the filmed version, he says Maddie deserves to know either way, but in the draft text, he really only wanted Dave to tell her that he wasn't interested.
~How does this written scene affect your understanding of David's reaction to Maddie the next morning?
I think now he realizes that the Spaceman has Maddie on short final (airplane term for approaching a landing) and that he MUST at least get Maddie to know that he really cares for her...in typical blunt Addison fashion of course.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:14:47 GMT -5
He really felt that Maddie was playing him. Hmm. Never thought of that before, but ya know...I buy it. That makes perfect Spidey Sense and explains his rage, which before now, to me, seemed a bit higher than I thought it should have been. I was using the viewpoint that Dave would be feeling quite confident that he was in the lead, but I had the advantage of knowing what was really going on between Maddie and Sam, which Dave obviously did not. WONDERFUL observation.
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Post by lin212 on Nov 3, 2009 21:16:18 GMT -5
9. Bruce has remarked in an interview that during the final bed scene, David says, "I love you, Maddie." Big question.......can you see it? Does it make a difference to you?Yes, I can see it, but it's hard because Cybill's hand is on Bruce's cheek. Does it make a difference? Yeah, to me it does. All up until now Dave was adamant that he did NOT have to make a verbal statement...that his deeds proved his love for Maddie. Dave also, by now has gotten it through his thick skull that hearing those words are indeed important to her, and he finally reciprocates. Yea she said she loved him when she thought she was talking to Sam but the fact remains it came out of her larynx. Finally, in the sack, they are even...they have both shown their love by their deeds, spoken their love through their words and are about to consummate their love...off camera of course. Darned PG rated networks. Spot on, gray...my thoughts exactly. I can see it as well and it makes a world of difference. Their smiles say it all.
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Post by beesnbears on Nov 3, 2009 21:17:07 GMT -5
4. Why can't David express his feelings to Maddie during their confrontation?
First and foremost, I think David has a very hard time expressing himself where his heart is put out there for someone who could possible hurt it. Think back to Tess and Jillian. I believe he loved those women at some point and then was hurt by them. So he is just plain afraid to put it out there.
Secondly, he is so confused that she doesn't even think it matters if they talk about Sam. He kissed her the night before, she came running to his apt., and they shared the most intimate moment they have ever shared together. It's a wonder he didn't quip, "Maddie, wasn't that you sitting on my trunk in my living room last night?"
And last, he really feels that Maddie should already know how he feels...and he's right, she does, I think, but she has to hear him say it to be sure. It's just the way Maddie is wired!
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Post by beesnbears on Nov 3, 2009 21:23:29 GMT -5
5. Agnes and Bert...aren't they the cutest ever? Why is their relationship so uncomplicated?
I just love'em both!! Their relationship is uncomplicated because they aren't afraid to admit how they feel about each other.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:24:21 GMT -5
7. Regarding the deleted parts of the bar scene...do they make Maddie's dilemma any more understandable?
Umm, I think she pretty much summed it up in the next scene when she "thought" she was talking to Sam in the bed, making this something from the Department of Redundancy Department.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:26:21 GMT -5
4. Why can't David express his feelings to Maddie during their confrontation?First and foremost, I think David has a very hard time expressing himself where his heart is put out there for someone who could possible hurt it. Think back to Tess and Jillian. I believe he loved those women at some point and then was hurt by them. So he is just plain afraid to put it out there. Secondly, he is so confused that she doesn't even think it matters if they talk about Sam. He kissed her the night before, she came running to his apt., and they shared the most intimate moment they have ever shared together. It's a wonder he didn't quip, "Maddie, wasn't that you sitting on my trunk in my living room last night?" And last, he really feels that Maddie should already know how he feels...and he's right, she does, I think, but she has to hear him say it to be sure. It's just the way Maddie is wired! Bees just saved me a lot of typing.
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Post by jpen on Nov 3, 2009 21:33:40 GMT -5
4. Why can't David express his feelings to Maddie during their confrontation?First and foremost, I think David has a very hard time expressing himself where his heart is put out there for someone who could possible hurt it. Think back to Tess and Jillian. I believe he loved those women at some point and then was hurt by them. So he is just plain afraid to put it out there. Secondly, he is so confused that she doesn't even think it matters if they talk about Sam. He kissed her the night before, she came running to his apt., and they shared the most intimate moment they have ever shared together. It's a wonder he didn't quip, "Maddie, wasn't that you sitting on my trunk in my living room last night?" And last, he really feels that Maddie should already know how he feels...and he's right, she does, I think, but she has to hear him say it to be sure. It's just the way Maddie is wired! Bees just saved me a lot of typing. Me, too-thanks, bees! ;D
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Nov 3, 2009 21:36:10 GMT -5
OMG, gray....you are the man! Another great avatar for the ages. There is an alternate version around here that I played with, but I think I just may stick with this one.
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Post by beesnbears on Nov 3, 2009 21:37:24 GMT -5
6. Give us your interpretation of "The barrage in the garage".
David takes the first swing out of frustration, but did he swing for the kill? His look after Sam pelts him is one of disbelief. Shocked that a guy of that stature could hit so damn hard and that Maddie would end up with someone who could be so physically abusive. And that look Bruce gives conveys David's confusion since the whole thing started in "Blonde on Blonde".
Yeah, I know Dave threw the first punch, but he didn't proceed to throw him into a wall and incapacitate him. Not saying Sam should have just stood there, but now that I've read the written version of the Sam/Dave scene in Dave's apt where he pushes him back on the bed, it makes me think there is this other side to Sam that Maddie just doesn't know!! And she wouldn't like it either...
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