goldilocks
3rd Level
You know he is perfect for me...but you and me...we...we..
Posts: 887
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Post by goldilocks on Mar 6, 2011 8:04:13 GMT -5
Oh don't get me wrong Goldster - He knew he'd made a terrible mistake and I believe he hated himself for it (shouldn't have done it in the first place I know!) - wish he'd felt that bad after sleeping with the 'A' word grrrrr. lol. I guess I just really felt for both of them! You're right - it's so horrible that he's sleeping with that woman when she rings him arghhhhhhhh! me right? you agree? No, I don't play this way Kidding, just kidding dear. I agree with you about Annie, both times he was unfaithful to Maddie, but the second time with Annie is so disgusting, he behaves completely out of the character...
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Post by bluemoonshampoo on Mar 6, 2011 10:49:59 GMT -5
Well, I guess I gotta let you be right some of the time right? LOL. He was, unfortunately some of the time, and fortunately some of the time- a man of action xxx
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Post by diane on Mar 6, 2011 11:13:38 GMT -5
Gotta jump in on this discussion. I have always really hated this episode....well, at least the end......and when I get that way, I really try and find something I can hang on to.
Couldn't quite get myself to watch it on this gloomy Sunday morning, but I read the script and found lots of things I had forgotten....or overlooked.
The script was really long, and they cut out lots. In fact I think the cuts in this episode are some of the most significant that I have seen. I am not sure I ever posted script cuts on this episode.....I'll see what I can do.....maybe later today!
One heart breaking scene is after David and Agnes have their conversation about Maddie coming back, David sits alone in his office when Bert comes in. David asks to be left alone, and when Bert leaves....making a comment about "it must be allergies", the scene shows David reaching across his desk for a tissue......when I read it, my heart just broke to think of David crying in the office. Of course, we know why they cut it......I don't think they wanted David to seem that vulnerable, especially with what was coming up later in the episode.
Then, when David goes to Maddie's house, and hears the answering machine......the script makes it seem very apparent that he believes she IS THERE, and that he is totally crushed when he realizes she isn't. And there are quite a few more messages on the machine that actually aired....you can feel David's frustration build with each message. That makes the angry call he makes to her so much more understandable, I think.
So still, he goes out and sleeps with Rita, right? I think of it this way...first, this is a totally out of character moment for David, one fueled by anger, hurt and liquor. In my younger years, I didn't think I ever could forgive David. In retrospect, now, I keep remembering the line from season 3 -- "men make love with their bodies, women make love with their hearts" And if it makes anybody feel any better, the following is the line from the script after David leaves Rita's condo.
ANGLE ON DAVID....SCUFFLING ALONG.....COLLAR UP and HEAD DOWN...infected with DESPAIR and SELF-LOATHING.......
What do you think?
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Post by sandra on Mar 6, 2011 11:50:48 GMT -5
heartbreaking line, Diane. Thanks for sharing.
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Post by bluemoonshampoo on Mar 6, 2011 12:04:30 GMT -5
ANGLE ON DAVID....SCUFFLING ALONG.....COLLAR UP and HEAD DOWN...infected with DESPAIR and SELF-LOATHING....... What do you think? Wow- sums it up exactly! I love the scripts - they shed so much light! I think it would have broken my heart to see him crying! :-( Yes, yes, yes -to posting some other deleted moments from this, it would be much appreciated. Funnily enough, I did think maybe they had cut a lot. When you get time of course :-)
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Post by rose35 on Mar 6, 2011 12:14:43 GMT -5
Gotta jump in on this discussion. I have always really hated this episode....well, at least the end......and when I get that way, I really try and find something I can hang on to. Couldn't quite get myself to watch it on this gloomy Sunday morning, but I read the script and found lots of things I had forgotten....or overlooked. The script was really long, and they cut out lots. In fact I think the cuts in this episode are some of the most significant that I have seen. I am not sure I ever posted script cuts on this episode.....I'll see what I can do.....maybe later today! One heart breaking scene is after David and Agnes have their conversation about Maddie coming back, David sits alone in his office when Bert comes in. David asks to be left alone, and when Bert leaves....making a comment about "it must be allergies", the scene shows David reaching across his desk for a tissue......when I read it, my heart just broke to think of David crying in the office. Of course, we know why they cut it......I don't think they wanted David to seem that vulnerable, especially with what was coming up later in the episode. Then, when David goes to Maddie's house, and hears the answering machine......the script makes it seem very apparent that he believes she IS THERE, and that he is totally crushed when he realizes she isn't. And there are quite a few more messages on the machine that actually aired....you can feel David's frustration build with each message. That makes the angry call he makes to her so much more understandable, I think. So still, he goes out and sleeps with Rita, right? I think of it this way...first, this is a totally out of character moment for David, one fueled by anger, hurt and liquor. In my younger years, I didn't think I ever could forgive David. In retrospect, now, I keep remembering the line from season 3 -- "men make love with their bodies, women make love with their hearts" And if it makes anybody feel any better, the following is the line from the script after David leaves Rita's condo. ANGLE ON DAVID....SCUFFLING ALONG.....COLLAR UP and HEAD DOWN...infected with DESPAIR and SELF-LOATHING....... What do you think? Oh this episode make me GRRRR at David so much! I hate that he did what he did! Couldnt he just bang up the BIMMER again? LOL ANd the fact the Maddie never finds out gets me mad too, i mean she could have found out in season 5? Another storyline? More angst! LOL Ok maybe we had enough angst! But i agree David feels like the worst person in the world after he did what he did. It didnt make him forget Maddie, it made him remember her more i think . Diane thanks for the script info! Would love to read more cut scenes too when you get the time of course! Even though we didnt see these scenes/lines , in my mind they really did happen cause they are on paper and the writer wanted it to happen but didnt have enough time to fit in episodes JMHO
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Post by diane on Mar 6, 2011 13:02:31 GMT -5
I'll try to get to the script after the baseball game -- the first televised game of the season!!! ;D
But in between, I did go watch the episode...you knew I would, didn't you?
I have a question.......it appears Maddie did not check the "see ya later" message from David before she tried to call him. Would it have made a difference if she did? And what do you think the difference would be?
(P.S. I just realized I have NEVER posted on this entire episode topic before today.....guess that tells you how I feel!).
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goldilocks
3rd Level
You know he is perfect for me...but you and me...we...we..
Posts: 887
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Post by goldilocks on Mar 6, 2011 14:19:11 GMT -5
And if it makes anybody feel any better, the following is the line from the script after David leaves Rita's condo. ANGLE ON DAVID....SCUFFLING ALONG.....COLLAR UP and HEAD DOWN...infected with DESPAIR and SELF-LOATHING....... What do you think? The line of course means a lot, and I can feel David's guilt when I read that line, of course he is "infected with DESPAIR and SELF-LOATHING"! He should be actually! I really wish they left that scene with David crying in his office, they'd better have cut out the last scene with Rita if they had to cut something out! Diane thank you very much for sharing! It is amazing how these little details help to see the things in a different light!
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Post by rose35 on Mar 6, 2011 19:03:29 GMT -5
I'll try to get to the script after the baseball game -- the first televised game of the season!!! ;D But in between, I did go watch the episode...you knew I would, didn't you? I have a question.......it appears Maddie did not check the "see ya later" message from David before she tried to call him. Would it have made a difference if she did? And what do you think the difference would be? (P.S. I just realized I have NEVER posted on this entire episode topic before today.....guess that tells you how I feel!). WOW 1st game already? ENJOY Diane! I know how you love your team! No worries! So funny you got to watch this episode! Ok so i always wondered about the message form David on her machine. Was it from the day she left? Did he call her home and leave that message when she didnt show up for work or is it an old message from one of the nights they spent together? Love the idea of him cooking for her, see it wasn't all bed was it then?
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Post by jpen on Mar 7, 2011 12:39:49 GMT -5
Diane said: "So still, he goes out and sleeps with Rita, right? I think of it this way...first, this is a totally out of character moment for David, one fueled by anger, hurt and liquor." Diane, I completely agree with you. It's hard to remember, sometimes, that in spite of the constant innuendo, the salacious comments, and the reputation David seems to have as a Casanova, we actually have no evidence that one-night stands are really his style. What we do know is that he's given his heart to three women, all of whom have played stickball with his guts. Given the rollercoaster his emotions have been on for the last two weeks, and the endless carousel of questions circling his mind ("Why'd she leave? Is it her? Is it me? Will she ever come back?"), it doesn't surprise me at all that he tries to take refuge in the Tunnel of Fleeting Pleasures. So do I hate that he slept with Rita? Of course I do--the scene in her bedroom makes me feel sick, every time. Does it drive me crazy that he's not there to get Maddie's phone call? You betcha--it's on a level with the Romeo-and-Juliet missed connections for me. But do I understand where he's coming from? Yep, and my heart breaks for him as he walks down that deserted street, as though all hope is lost.
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Post by diane on Mar 7, 2011 22:48:50 GMT -5
Agreed, jen. You know, you just can't hate David because he has just been through so much. Besides, I think his self loathing at that moment in the cold grey dawn may be punishment enough.
Still, I think when he tosses the keys at Bert could be my #2 "I could almost hate him" moment. Number 1? Does "get out of my bed?" ring a bell with anyone....(sorry, it's a little off topic, but grrrrrrrrrrrr.)
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Post by diane on Mar 7, 2011 23:13:45 GMT -5
Ok.....I read the script again......will pull out a few things. I do think I misinterpreted the scene at Maddie's house......I'll explain when I get there.
First, the episode opens with the scene from The Philadelphia Story.....but Maddie can't take it. She goes downstairs, where her parents are entertaining another couple at Bridge. Alex is telling the story about Maddie's uncle and the false teeth.....a little less delicately than Virginia told it to Maddie in the car. (An aside....that scene between Maddie and her mother is so precious to me.....I am so glad they cycled the story into that episode and got rid of it here.)
Maddie tries to duck by, but she is caught and has to make small talk......it's an odd scene with a few lame jokes......really doesn't seem to serve much purpose except maybe to heighten Alex's anxiety about Maddie's acting strangely.....it probably was a good edit.
The scene between Alex and Virginia in the bedroom is pretty much spot on......a couple more comments on her not going out, calling old friends.....Virginia does admit to Alex that she thinks Maddie is depressed.
After this, you get the other two movie scenes...Barbara Stanwyck and Gary Cooper, and then William Powell and Myrna Loy.......Maddie getting more irate, until she angrily punches remote buttons and the screen goes black.
Things go along as aired, until we come to Bert and David in his office. Actually in my copy, I have both the way it aired and an alternate...neither of which seem to be fully formed. I'll type them as it is...with revision dates.
REVISED 8/13/87
DAVID: (finally, his back still to him) Listen...Burt...nothing personal...I'd just kinda like to be by myself for a minute...y'know?
VIOLA: (trying to understand) By yourself?
DAVID: (after a moment, still not looking back) Yeah....y'know...
VIOLA: (starting to understand) Oh. Yeah....I know.....
ANOTHER ANGLE
...as Viola begins BACKING away toward the door....
Viola (continued) I do....(and then)...No problem......(and then)....It sure is tough being a guy...isn't it, Mr. Addison?
..and VIOLA backs out David's door...taking one final, concerned look at.....
OMIT 94
Davids chair
...not turning around...and we hold for the LONGEST TIME......and then.....
CUT TO BLACK
REVISED 5/29/87
DAVID: No.....(and then)....uh uh...
ON VIOLA....gingerly backing away towards the door.....
VIOLA: Uh......Probably allergies then...pollen count's through the roof.....(and then)....well, like I was saying....(and then)...it sure is tough being a guy.
...and VIOLA backs out David's door...taking one final, concerned look at.....
DAVID'S CHAIR
....not turning around...but after we've HEARD HIS DOOR CLOSE...all we see is HIS HAND FLASHING ACROSS HIS DESK TO WHIP A TISSUE out of a TISSUE BOX......and we......
CUT TO BLACK.
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Post by diane on Mar 7, 2011 23:43:24 GMT -5
Doing this in phases...don't want to type for an hour and get logged out!
The party discussion and planning , are all pretty much the same, and so is the meeting with the accountant, and Agnes's idea about going to Maddie's house.
Now, I may have to apologize......when I read it the other day, albeit quickly, I really thought David thought Maddie was at home. When I read it again, I amend that thought....I am going to give you the whole scene...just for the telephone messages.....when I watched the other day, I finally realized that this is an episode I don't know exceptionally well -- probably becasue I really don't like it, and hence haven't watched it a million times like I have the others. Well anyway.......here is the scene:
INTERIOR OF MADDIE'S HOUSE
...as the FRONT DOOR opens....revealing DAVID ADDISON......and he enters, burdened by CARRYING a week's worth of newspapers he's picked up from Maddie's front lawn....
CLOSER ON DAVID.......
...shoving a little frustratedly at the DOOR...trying to push against something keeping it from swinging all the way open......until he looks down......
AT THE FLOOR
BESIDE THE DOOR...where there's an AVALANCHE of MAIL that's been shoved through the MAIL SLOT and not picked up.......and which now hinders the door.....
ANGLE
...as David just lets the armload of newspapers drop to the floor......and he closes the door behind him...then CROUCHES by the mail slot.....beginning to stack the envelopes neatly...and just then we hear Maddie's telephone ring somewhere in her house....and David pays it no mind as he continues cleaning up the mail...until he hears -- from the ANSWERING MACHINE somewhere......
MECHANICAL VOICE (O.S.) (filtered) Hello....you have four messages....I'll play them back to you now....
ON DAVID
....ears pricked......Standing up...and Listening.....
DAVID'S VOICE (O.S.) (filtered, pretty playful) : Maddie....it's Dirty Dave.....F.Y.I. yours truly is stopping off at Trader Joe's on the way home, cause guess what: I'm making you dinner. Candlelight, vino, and steak a la Dave. Clear off a space on the rug, lady.
(and we hear a BEEP signalling the ned of the message)
ANGLE
...as DAVID realizes who's calling Maddie's machine...
DAVID: (to himself) Maddie?
..and he stands there, not knowing what to do as he hears...
DAVID'S VOICE: (O.S.) (filtered) : Yo Maddie...this is the Big Blue Moon Bopper.....'ey whose idea was spending the night apart? I got a pillow wadded up next to me....I got four pillows wadded up next to me......worst hicky I ever got.....
BEEP
...and as David rushes for the stairs.....
DAVID: (yelling) : MAddie!
ANOTHER ANGLE
...as David charges up the stairs...under which....
DAVID'S VOICE (O.S.) (filtered, a third call, now a little concerned and weary)
Ey, Goldilocks, ...you sick? Takin' a nap? Too much porridge? Where're you hiding?
BEEP
CUT TO:
INTERIOR MADDIE'S BEDROOM
...as David rushes in..runs towards the phone next to the lit answering machine by the bed.....under which.....
DAVID's VOICE (O.S.) (filtered; a fourth message, wearier and more strained still)
Hello, M? D. Where the bleep are you?
BEEP
...and as David lunges for the phone..snatches up the receiver....
DAVID (yelling into the receiver): Hello, Maddie! Are you still there, Maddie?!
but he's too late.....all he hears emanating from the phone is a LOUD DIALTONE...and DAVID stands there helplessly....HURT......ANGRY....BREATHING HARD.....and we...
CUT TO --- scene with Bert spying on Agnes and Magillicuddy.....
There are a few more small scenes....not a lot worth mentioning......the message on David's machine when Maddie calls him after she finds out she is pregnant is different if you want to hear that.....
Also there is kind of a creepy little scene at the party with Maddie's high school drama teacher trying to hit on her.......take my word.....yick!
I'll go through the end again and see if there is anything else notable but for now, time for bed!
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Post by jpen on Mar 8, 2011 1:34:57 GMT -5
Agreed, jen. You know, you just can't hate David because he has just been through so much. Besides, I think his self loathing at that moment in the cold grey dawn may be punishment enough. Still, I think when he tosses the keys at Bert could be my #2 "I could almost hate him" moment. Number 1? Does "get out of my bed?" ring a bell with anyone....(sorry, it's a little off topic, but grrrrrrrrrrrr.)Grrrrrrrrr and double-grrrrrrrrrrr. That's the one I find very very hard to forgive!
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Post by jpen on Mar 8, 2011 1:38:10 GMT -5
Diane, thanks as always for these script notes--they do help to shed light on where David is coming from. Like you, I'm glad they cut the bridge-playing scene, because I love the car talk with Virginia so much! OK, time for bed out here in AZ too.
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