Something is bugging me about a line in an episode and I would like to see if anyone else can help sort it out.
We all know David's speech to Mr. Hayes in "Father Knows Last." I used to call my friends after every episode and this one was just a real stunner.
Dave says, in part, "I asked her to marry me. She said no."
Where was a scene about that? It should have been one of the most important in the history of the show!
I don't remember seeing anything like it, and I'm puzzled as to whether they: wrote it but did not film it; wrote or filmed it but edited it out later; planned it but did not have a chance to film it, due to the challenges we all know about, surrounding filming that year; or, neither wrote nor filmed it, and it's just in the speech because they forget to edit it out for continuity.
The very last possibilty would be, then, that David is bluffing here and didn't say it, but wants her father to think he did. I don't care what age your daughter is, even well into adulthood--if you're a father you probably feel very protective of her, and if she 'got in the family way' and had no one to help her, that would pretty well tick you off. David is trying to stay in the family's good graces. He still means the same thing inside, he just had to talk his way out of a potentially very awkward situation. I don't think he was devious, as such--not at all; merely very worried, and trying to make things right.
Oh I don't know, I'm not sure David would lie about something like that though, not at this stage. He didn't look like he was lying, he looked completely honest (for once!). I think this is a problem with the writing really, referring to something huge that the viewers haven't seen. Seeing as Maddie ran off, David must have proposed to her during those few weeks they were together... Unless there's some reference in A Trip to the Moon that I've missed?!!?
"You can lead a horse to water, but that doesn't make it a duck"
I don't thinjk you missed anything Mul, I always wondered about this too. I agree with you - I don't think it's a case of David not telling the truth, I think it's more to do with the writing. Perhaps there originally was some kind of scene where he asked her and it got edited out and the writters forgot about it or something. Or maybe it's just something that we have to assume happened at some point, without us actually having seen it.
When Maddie and David are driving in the car, she says something is bothering her and her mother (or something similar to that.. ), and he says: Okey, tell her I´ll marry you". Maybe that´s it?
Is that so? Is it a quote or a guess? Would the reference be in "A Trip to the Moon"? If that's true, thank you, as it would solve something I've been wondering about ever since I saw "Father Knows Last." When I called up my friends after the show, that was the first line they jumped to. "Did you see it? Did you hear what he said? I don't remember him saying to her--" That sort of thing. I'll see if I can look up my copies of the other episodes and check it out for myself. Thanks.
Well, I will have to watch it again to be absolutely sure, but I know I have seen it somewhere... But it could also be that he was going to propose the night Sam came into our lives. I can guess, but I can never be sure. I just thought that I had kind of seen something that David could call a proposal when he said it..
Thanks. I'll try and look for it and see if there's anything like that.
Intriguing idea about the end of "Blonde on Blonde" as well. That could have been true. From the beginning of that episode, he was acting very different. Once the funny scene with the poker game is over, things change. He goes from kidding around to being seriously worried about her mood. (It's his corollary to the weird way Maddie is acting.) Then he actually kneels down in front of the couch, the better to look right in her eyes while he's asking what's wrong. It is an oddly echoic gesture, when you look at the picture...
At the end, we know he said one thing when he was leaving jail, and it's crude but funny; still, just before that, he'd come to a rather serious revelation at Joan's prompting. We know he covers everything up by making fun of it, but we also know that thisis far more important than the average 'scratching an itch.' He had literally years to find somebody else if he wanted to, but he kept trying to get back to Maddie. Bar his brief interval with Jillian, there's nobody meaningful in his life; he brags and jokes about casual conquests, but none of them apparently stick and stay. (Oddly enough, he's as alone as Maddie is after all her dates that he makes fun of.) He's still going after Maddie, no matter how she rebuffs him.
And he picks the flowers. Very spur-of-the-moment, but then, he obviously did not have a chance to go to a shop. But he wouldn't have made that gesture at all if he didn't mean for this time to be special. (It's the opposite of what someone would do if they just wanted something earthy and cheap.)
If all he wanted to do was hit on her, number one he'd been doing that before, and two he didn't have to go to her house to do that. Although we're sure he must have been hoping something else would develop, the real reason he went there was to tell her what he'd admitted in the cell. Think about it. Any other person who'd spent the night following people around, climbing in stranger's windows, getting the daylights kicked out of them, and finally being mistaken for a criminal and spending a few hours in jail, would have either then checked into a hospital or crawled under the covers at home and slept for, I don't know, the next few years! Heck, I'd be in a padded room! But David, bless his heart, keeps going. ;D That alone shows you this time was unique.
If only the wrong person hadn't answered the door!
Every daughters father is a virgin, was the episode I was thinking about.. On their way to the restaurant to meet her parents he says he´ll marry her.. That can not be the proposal he was referring to, at least I don´t think so.
But when he is in jail, when he´s mixed-up with that other man, in the Cool hand Dave-stuff, he calls Maddie and Doesn´t he ask her to marry him then? Of course, it´s not Maddie who answers, it´s her mother, but anyway. That counts?
Maybe, I don´t know, I don´t care, I don´t know, you know? (or however she says it in The Dreamsequence..)
I really don´t like Sam, but anyway I find myself in front of the TV to watch Navy CIS (with Mark Harmon) every singel time it´s on... Anyone else has that problem?
I really have mixed feelings about MH to. He came in and destroyed Davids confessing his love to Maddie, but would the big bang have happened without him? I certainly hope it would have, so then its okay not to like Sam, or MH...
Post by queensgirl on Jan 12, 2006 15:33:13 GMT -5
True. David had been in an odd state where she was concerned for years. We know what he thought about her, and if you're observant you know it developed fairly early, but although he constantly hinted and joked around the fact of being attracted to her, he was not able, or perhaps not ready, to say in so many words that the feelings went deeper until much later. We know what he thinks, but he has to be threatened by outside forces in order to feel provoked that it's now or never.
Look to that scene early in "Blonde on Blonde," when all of a sudden he switches from the fun of the poker game to noticing that Maddie's acting a little strange. So he kneels down and pleads for her to tell him the truth. "If anything's causing you pain, I definitely want to know about it..."
Pretty close right there. And with what follows. You don't go chasing somebody all over town out of fear for their safety--and desire for them to be with you instead--unless there is something very serious going on.
It does take (literally) a beating and a stint in jail for Dave to get rattled enough to admit that it's that word. Although I half wonder if he really knew it already, he just didn't want to say it because then he knew he'd have to confront her. And possibly be rejected, lose his job, who knows...perhaps he was already thinking about this, but kept it secret because like anybody else, like her in fact, he didn't want to be embarrassed in the event that he should lose or her interest not be the same. This had to become worse when she actually tells him she's looking for someone else.
Although they actually did 'go out' for the evening in "Symphony in Knocked Flat," that one is almost in the atmosphere of a friendly dare. At other times I seem to remember random mentions of somebody grabbing some dinner at the end of the day, though this would seem to be just the average thing people from the same office always do. So it almost has to become a threat that, watch it, pal, she could be gone!--before David is pushed to go into motion.
I watched some of this part of the series recently and noticed two things. One, Sam seemed to be a bit more jumpy than I'd ever thought before. Kind of something about his eyes. He usually projects this attitude of being laconic and supposedly the perfect match 'on paper,' but watch him here and there and see if he isn't nervous and fidgety every so often. Hmmm. (In the restaurant, he just glares, and when he's at the house to ask her, I don't know, I just get this funny look.) Disturbing.
I am almost convinced that he was in a hurry to propose to Maddie in order to head David off at the pass. From the moment David showed up at the door--and do you think Sam noticed the flowers?--to the interruption at the restaurant, Sam had to figure that something was going on. He'd immediately contrast himself with David, then, and probably reason he'd better do something David hadn't. Sam considers himself a better person than David, more high class if you know what I mean, and his jump statement forced Maddie to suddenly compare which one of them was really right for her. It also shocked David into a sense of desperation, that time was really running out.
What ramps up the shock even more is the fact that David almost didn't know about the big announcement. Maddie was not inclined to tell him, and I'm sure Sam wasn't going to let him know. What if she and Sam had just gone away for the weekend and...you know?
Would have been the end of the world for poor David.
This isn't the first time in the show that David was cornered and didn't know what to do. As much as he kids Maddie about different things, in a crisis, he also turns to her for help. Look at the fight with his father in "The Son Also Rises." But now, since the issue is about Maddie herself, he doesn't have her to finish solving the problem and must go it on his own.
I believe Mr. Caron says something in one of the commentaries about the different effect the characters have on each other.
"He gives her a sense of humor," he says, and then she gets him to edge from being the raffish party boy to a forthright, confident man.
"The truth will out." And thank goodness for it.
(26 days and counting--four weeks from last Tuesday!... ;D)