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Post by diane on Dec 16, 2008 12:32:27 GMT -5
I have to admit, I love this episode so much, I am having difficulty with the questions. I think the episode is so perfect that I kind of hate to start picking it apart.
That said, I will start you off with a few. I will be working this evening and not able to join you, but as I know you will, feel free to add more questions and ideas......
Happy watching!
1. At first thought, the idea of Maddie Hayes ever contemplating suicide seems almost unbelievable. What is your reaction to the whole concept, and what kind of a job do you think they did in pulling it off?
2. For those of you who know "It's a Wonderful Life", do you feel the episode is reflective of the movie, or is it just the use of the tilte that makes it memorable?
3. In spite of seeming to give up, where do you think Maddie shows her strength in this episode?
4. Pop quiz...... what ML historical inaccuracy is found in this episode?
5. Which one of the vignettes of life without Blue Moon makes the largest impression on Maddie...or is it the sum of the whole?
6. "if people are meant to be together, they'll find each other...no matter where, no matter how." Does this really sound like Maddie?
7. Quite simply, what's your favorite scene?
Hope you've all got visions of sugarplums dancing in your heads. Enjoy!
diane
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graycav56
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I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 17:35:10 GMT -5
OK, I'll jump onto the first one, since I have to bail here for an hour or two.
You know, I never bought that suicide angle either, at least not in the rooftop scene. I felt that she just wanted to get away and catch some fresh air. Of course, her Guardian Angel would know better, and he was pretty convinced that she was thinking of doing the old swan dive. Of course, jumping off a roof doesn’t kill you…it’s the quick stop at the end that does the trick.
I feel completely different about the “other” Maddie. After seeing how she lost the business, her home, the rest of her money and all her friends, I could see how her aunt's death just might push her off the edge….or into a wall as it were.
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graycav56
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I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 18:27:28 GMT -5
2. For those of you who know "It's a Wonderful Life", do you feel the episode is reflective of the movie, or is it just the use of the title that makes it memorable?
I think it was a perfect link up. The George Bailey-Maddie Hayes match was spectacular. It seems like tons of folks have done their own versions of the Christmas Classic, but to me, this one stands heads and shoulders above the rest.
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 16, 2008 19:13:59 GMT -5
1. At first thought, the idea of Maddie Hayes ever contemplating suicide seems almost unbelievable. What is your reaction to the whole concept, and what kind of a job do you think they did in pulling it off?
This is a dream and dreams are usually made of things that we would never do or say or things that more than likely would never happen to us. I don’t think Maddie would ever consider suicide an option for her troubles in real life and quite possibly the writers felt the same, so they did what they always do on ML----DREAM SEQUENCE!!!!! Only this one is based on a very popular Christmas movie. So we get to actually see how Maddie is really suffering emotionally and mentally with Blue Moon and her employees, as well as her true feelings for David. This is just like the other dream sequences where they are able to communicate their innermost feelings without worrying about showing who loves who more. And it pulls watchers in so they tune in for the next episode. Brilliant, or what?!?!
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 16, 2008 19:18:11 GMT -5
2. For those of you who know "It's a Wonderful Life", do you feel the episode is reflective of the movie, or is it just the use of the title that makes it memorable?
I thought it really did mimic the movie. We watch it every year. It’s great-great!!
3. In spite of seeming to give up, where do you think Maddie shows her strength in this episode?
She showed the perseverance of a working woman in the 80’s. Keeping Blue Moon’s doors open was probably not easy. She shows commitment to her employees by trying to earn that extra buck. Her only mistake was asking them to work on Christmas Day!! And another strength is when she returns at the end and basically admits she was wrong and asks McGuillicuddy to stay. It is not easy to admit you are wrong when you feel everyone is against you, but she marched back into the office and did just that.
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 16, 2008 19:31:17 GMT -5
5. Which one of the vignettes of life without Blue Moon makes the largest impression on Maddie...or is it the sum of the whole?
2 scenes. The Agnes and Burt scene and the David and Cheryl Tiegs scene.
The first was a very clever way of saying how Maddie and David feel about each other. Like so many times in ML, they used Agnes and Burt to play David and Maddie. This scene is very important because we also see Maddie admit that she knows David loves her and she also admits something about herself and that is that she does have a genuine heart and does care about people.
Some telling quotes: “ This isn’t you.” Meaning this isn’t me.
“This is not how you deal with people or situations.” Meaning I know I was wrong and should treat my employees better.
“No, you can’t treat him like that. You love him.” Meaning I love him.
“He loves you, you are crazy about each other.” Meaning I know he loves me too.
And then Maddie wants to know more about herself when she asks “How did she get this way?” Meaning how did I get this way?
This ties in with the David and Cheryl Tiegs scenes. She is so sure that David was a complete failure without her and this vignette was a great way to nudge her heart a little more in recognizing what he means to her. And she was still a little cool towards him here until David lays that slo-mo kiss on Cheryl and then started talking about her softness and warmth and how he really admired her with Richie. She gets to see herself through David’s eyes and then realizes that what they have had so far was real!..the kiss in the garage, the trip to NYC, Paul the DJ and how David was jealous, piano player and the “mature” bet, and the trip to Buenos Aires.
And what is really cool, I think, is that the things that she learns through her entire dream are some of the things that she learns from David as the show carries on for another 2 years.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 19:36:32 GMT -5
3. In spite of seeming to give up, where do you think Maddie shows her strength in this episode?
Agree with Bees post on this one. Good job.
She pretty much laid it on the line with the bartender and on the roof I think she was ready to clobber Albert, if you mean physical strength. For strength by another definition, I think that she, by allowing life to be changed even though it was bad for her, therefore very good for David, she was being a tad altruistic. However that changed when she saw the new Maddie about ready to slam the Bimmer into a wall…but who can blame her?
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 19:37:56 GMT -5
4. Pop quiz...... what ML historical inaccuracy is found in this episode?
I’m taking a guess here. I think it was where they are in the Hart Detective Agency, and Lionel mentions they bought the place from Blue Moon. I think it would have been City of Angels…assuming she closed it on the first go around.
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Post by beesnbears on Dec 16, 2008 19:42:23 GMT -5
I know I am being piggish, but I am on a roll!! ;D 6. "if people are meant to be together, they'll find each other...no matter where, no matter how." Does this really sound like Maddie? I think this ties in with what happens just previously in the bar. She thinks she will end up with David without Blue Moon “if it is meant to be”. I believe this is her last ditch effort of wanting things to be easier in life with no worries of running a business. BUT, she still wants David in her life. I guess you can't have your cake and eat it too!! And amazing how when her life flashes before her eyes all the scenes had to do with how she really feels about David and indeed, they were very intense. So yes, I think it does sound like Maddie. It is the Maddie that we don’t see very often, but we know it is there. 7. Quite simply, what's your favorite scene? Just 3 words: “I miss David”.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 19:53:56 GMT -5
5. Which one of the vignettes of life without Blue Moon makes the largest impression on Maddie...or is it the sum of the whole?
I think David’s. She looked absolutely catty when she saw Dave and Cheryl smooching it up, and her passionate monologue (that David could not hear) about how great they were together did it for me.
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Post by lin212 on Dec 16, 2008 19:59:16 GMT -5
Hi everyone. Before I jump into the questions, I want to say what a great job Cybill did in this episode. She takes us through so many different emotions and we can feel her sadness, despair, and finally her fighting spirit. Second, this episode aired Dec. 16, 1986 and I am thrilled that we are discussing it still exactly 22 years later!
1. Suicide- I agree with graycav on this one. I feel that the Maddie we know would never consider suicide, no matter how many difficulties she faces. The "dream" Maddie, however, has sunken to the depths of despair. The way she is described by Albert makes her decision to commit suicide believable (at the end, not the roof scene). I think the writers pull it off.
3. I think Maddie shows her strength when she fights to get her life back. She doesn't accept Albert's declaration that it is too late. She screams and demands that he must turn the clock back. She wants her business, her friends, David. In this scene, she fights back more furiously than in any other scene that I can think of.
4. The inaccuracy - I believe you are right, graycav. If Maddie closed the agency when she first showed up on David's doorstep, there never would have been a Blue Moon.
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graycav56
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I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 20:00:06 GMT -5
Here's a short break before I answer the other questions.
I watched this episode on my 1986 copy, which is cool to do sometimes. This one came complete with commercials from WPVI, the ABC Channel 6 affilliate in Philadelphia. Some of the commercials:
First break: Diet Coke, Movie: Little Shop of Horrors, Prudential Insurance, TV Shows: Perfect Strangers and Head of the Class.
Second break: Isotoner gloves, Movie: No Mercy, TV Shows: Dynasty and Hotel, A Hertz Rent-A-Car ad with, get this...OJ SIMPSON, Corningware.
Third Break: Alka Seltzer, Chevrolet Blazer, Movie: Crimes of the Heart (Chick Flick), Zales Jewelers, TV Show: The Colbys
Last Break: Plymouth Sundance, TV Show: Jack and Mike
After Credits: Bruce Willis in Seagram's Golden Wine Cooler holiday ad.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 20:04:56 GMT -5
6. "if people are meant to be together, they'll find each other...no matter where, no matter how." Does this really sound like Maddie?
Yeah, I could hear her saying this. She always seemed to go back and forth about her core beliefs in what made the universe go around. As we learned “In God We Strongly Suspect” she wasn’t the traditional religious gal. However, she was quick to float that Albert was a genie or a witch, leading me to think she did have some mystic values, therefore it wouldn’t be a stretch to think of some type of nonstandard higher power….some kismet.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 20:07:33 GMT -5
Lin: GREAT point on the fight with Albert to get him to bend the rules. Agree 100%.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Dec 16, 2008 20:12:37 GMT -5
7. Quite simply, what's your favorite scene.
Uh, the last one on the desk….Bruce is one lucky fella.
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