|
Post by lin212 on Sept 18, 2006 14:24:38 GMT -5
I believe that Glenn Caron has said that the most important factor in writing ML was to remain true to the story of David and Maddie. IMHO, Glenn was off the mark in this episode when he had Maddie questioning her relationship with David. I realize that he had to devise a scenario to deal with her departure, but his choice of "problems" doesn't ring true.
Maddie says that she and David don't have a relationship - a relationship is something that starts small, you go out, talk, find out if you have anything in common, etc. If someone were tuning in to ML for the first time, one might think that David picked Maddie up in a bar and their entire relationship consisted of "thrashing". They are way beyond getting to know each other. They have spent nearly every day of the last three years together. They have talked about everything from romance and religion to favorite foods, music and movies. They are best friends. Remember "I want to be the one to throw that first clump of dirt on your coffin" or "we spend more time together than with anyone else" or "I am closer to you than anyone else out here"?? What about Buenos Aires and New York? I think they know each other inside and out.
Maddie also says that she knows what it is to dance with David in a Laundromat at 2:00 in the morning and to spend 14 hours in bed with him, but doesn't know what it's like to go to a coffee shop at noon and order cheeseburgers. How crazy is that statement? How many breakfasts, lunches and dinners must they have had over the past 3 years?
She also complains that they arrive at work separately, act aloof all day, say good-bye at 5:30 and then somehow always end up together. She is the one who wants to keep the relationship a secret. If it weren't a secret, then all of the above wouldn't exist.
I don't know. It seems that it would have made more sense for Maddie to continue with her "you're not the one I'm supposed to be with" philosophy. At least that would have been more in character and true to their story.
Just my opinion...
|
|
|
Post by rose35 on Sept 18, 2006 19:33:05 GMT -5
Wow Lin you are so right with all those points. If any 2 people knew each other it was these 2. Maddie does act like they just met. I believe it was Maddie's being scared of if David really loved her or if it was just sex and also David doesn't seem like the type of guy Maddie would be used to dating. Ah so many layers to this show huh?
|
|
|
Post by adyjdy on Sept 18, 2006 23:10:04 GMT -5
Wouldn't it have been easier, clearer and more honest to just have her find out she's pregnant, freak out and run away? That would have made some sense to me.
|
|
|
Post by Mulberry on Sept 19, 2006 5:34:27 GMT -5
You are sooo right Lin. As you say, it's not as if they went straight from meeting to the sack. They had two years of bees being and ducks ducking. They went through SO much together, they gradually got closer and closer, they knew each other inside out, and THEN it become impossible for them not to get together. They had spent literally hours talking and arguing and driving together and having fine/fun before this. Several times Maddie had made a small move towards him, she seemed to want it to happen. She was the one trying to make him tell her how he felt about her.
I can understand her freaking out over how overwhelming her feelings were, but I can't understand why she freaks out about their relationship being 'just physical' when its her who it limiting it... and they had only got together for a few weeks. Odd in the extreme!
Mul
|
|
|
Post by lin212 on Sept 19, 2006 15:16:09 GMT -5
I guess my point is that I am surprised that Glenn could write such a script. It sounds like it came from someone who knew nothing about the history of David and Maddie.
|
|
Johanna
3rd Level
Stranger who? Stranger me? They don't get any stranger...
Posts: 671
|
Post by Johanna on Sept 20, 2006 8:05:41 GMT -5
Couldn't agree more. Since when does Maddie go to a coffee shop and order cheese burgers? Does not sound like something she would be interested in doing with anyone.
David and Maddie got to know each other while working together on cases, right? Right. If she wouldn't have avoided him at work they could have kept on having those great talks in the car there's no way she would have felt like she didn't know him. It doesn't have to be called a date to be a date. But one thing that's true to Maddie's character is that she thinks way too much.
|
|
|
Post by rose35 on Sept 20, 2006 19:20:15 GMT -5
I always wondered about that comment about the cheeseburgers. It seems like they probably always ate at expensive restaurants becuase of Maddie. If you remember in FKL David says to Maddie's father in the fancy restaurrant "This is Maddie's favorite restaurant" Daivd is definately a cheeseburger type guy. Remember also when David asks Maddie at her front door when they are going out for their date , He mentions going to a bar and she is like god no,no bars! Yet she questions how they never went out to eat cheeseburgers. Weird!
|
|
|
Post by lin212 on Sept 21, 2006 7:05:03 GMT -5
Remember The Bride of Tupperman? She wanted to go the new sea food place? I agree, Maddie was not a cheeseburger gal - Terri was the cheeseburger type. Again, it just puzzles me why Glenn gave her those words to say.
|
|
Tamm
1st Level
Posts: 68
|
Post by Tamm on Sept 23, 2006 14:57:54 GMT -5
Remember The Bride of Tupperman? She wanted to go the new sea food place? I agree, Maddie was not a cheeseburger gal - Terri was the cheeseburger type. Again, it just puzzles me why Glenn gave her those words to say. At times Glenn seemed way off the mark in this episode but I love when Maddie says she loves David
|
|
|
Post by Frontier on Jul 6, 2007 10:06:20 GMT -5
I couldn't agree more with all the above posts. Even on the commentary, Bruce mentions - many times - how Glenn could write that. Glenn, did acknowledge that some of it's writing of this episode was off the mark, but it stayed only on Bruce's character, not Cybill's. This is kinda odd because on this episode, it's mostly Maddie that it's out of character (and logic) on what she says in a far greater deal than David, yet they discuss mostly about David. I have to hand it to Glenn however that the last comment he made regarding the season 4 start episode (Bruce Willis did not even know it was a season starter episode): "I have no idea of what I was doing" (regarding Maddie - David relationship). A pity that the whole world still thinks that sex was the jtsm of Moonlighting
|
|
raul
1st Level
Posts: 23
|
Post by raul on Aug 31, 2007 13:33:47 GMT -5
My first quick thoughts after watching this episode again for the first time in the last years and after listening Bruce and Glenn's comments are: - I don't dislike it. In fact, I like it, not the Maddie versus mirror, not exactly the Ray Charles, not at all the monologue in front of the door, but leaving it apart (well, not bad, almost a third of the chapter! ) I like the Maddie's office part, the ending part at the Laundromat, the car's ambivalence part... -BY SURE, i like it much more than Bruce! OK, the series was obviously going down, but not as hard as he says, and, in fact, it was just the mirror of their relationship evolution, wich brings me to... -I have seen in this chapter a reality I didn't know could be so clear (at least, it is for me): David loves Maddie but she just don't. It's over for her, she really loves him as a friend, whatever you call it, but not a lover or heart partner anymore. But she doesn't want to hurt him so she talks over and over letting fell things (ambivalence, doubts...) that sound so clear as bells from a heartache, from someone that loved but doesn't feel it anymore. I agree a lot with Bruce; David would have seen the signs and, with proud, give the next step of finish any contact (the agency?) before she does it. But he is blinded or he doesn't want to see it or trust her. -Then, in some way, I can understand her departing. She just can't be next to him day after day without having the need to tell him she doesn't love him - and then, she doesn't want to finish with the agency, in some way she likes it and the way they work. It's just that she sees clearly he is in love with her and that he won't want to be partners as they were before. So she takes the plain. As I said in some other post, I find the entire series a very good portrait of a real relationship, with the very good parts we all love and the very bad parts we all hate or are afraid of. Isn't it great, that even the bad parts of the show can be considered as a part of a mature show? I do, and it works for me
|
|
nazel
1st Level
Posts: 90
|
Post by nazel on Jun 29, 2008 18:58:05 GMT -5
Oh great insights you guys .. It's really sad how much the writers screwed up the show after season 3 it has become an amazing show, & I thought it was just beginning but it was actually the end
|
|
|
Post by rsteele on Aug 25, 2008 22:32:00 GMT -5
I suggest youse er, guys watch The NEXT MURDER YOU HEAR again. Paul McCain (one of the best "victims") says something like "What is this relationship stuff?" "It seems like something folks have while waiting for Love to come along."
Now, that's *not* an exact quote, but does get to the nitty gritty; nest-ce pas?
|
|
|
Post by callmeditzy on Sept 8, 2008 19:26:47 GMT -5
I thought of Maddie's ridiculous "cheeseburgers" comment the other day while watching All Creatures Great and Not So Great. They had pizza together! She even commented on how nice it was for them (Burt and Agnes, too) to be kicking off their shoes and enjoying a pizza together!
|
|
|
Post by maddieaddisonjr on Sept 19, 2008 22:39:19 GMT -5
I'm not sure why Glenn would suddenly not know what he was doing with David and Maddie's relationship. It had been unfolding towards completion since the story (that Glenn created) began. Maddie was written nonsensically in S4, plain and simple. She has worked side by side with the man for several years. Argued with him, supported him (Mulberry), been supported by him (Money Talks), loved him and was loved by him and certainly they have eaten together. To me the time for uncertainty was long past. The only thing left for Maddie to say was 'Yes' to going the whole nine yards with David, acknowledging to him and everyone else that they were indeed in a relationship. And it wasn't "going to the moon." It was just going.
|
|