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Post by jpen on Feb 17, 2009 21:26:35 GMT -5
Does Maddie’s suggestive attitude entice viewers to believe she’s making an effort to continue a sexual relationship with David? I think the ending shows an intent on Roger Director's part to try and light the spark between the two characters again. Let's face it, the man knew the magic......and was one of the very few left who could try to recreate it. However, the entire writing staff never seemed to have a long range plan for season 5, and we got disjointed episodes that never seemed to flow. Correct me if I am wrong, but outside of Womb, and the Annie episodes...couldn't you just toss all the rest in a box, and determine which should come next? I don't feel there is any continuity in season 5...which is part of the problem. My previous comment notwithstanding, I agree--all of the "moments" that we get between them could have come in any order. I suppose it would have made the most sense to put "Take My Wife" before "Perfetc"....aah, forget it--it's too frustrating!
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Post by sinceifell4u on Feb 17, 2009 21:29:42 GMT -5
OK...you know I always look at the oddities....... Did you notice.....? How the heck did Maddie crawl all over those concrete beams, and not shred her hose? Check out David in the courthouse when he says "Excuse me, Mr. Fast....." It is one of Bruce's best "Joisey" accents going! How horrible is Maddie's first response to David when he catches her in his office? The scene does build to a little bit of a climax, but it really starts out to looking like the scene was going to be phoned in. LOL to the oddities! Maddie's first response seems like she is in disbelief that she got caught IMO. It's kinda like that point between getting caught, realizing you've been caught and how you're going explain yourself out of it. Maddie, of course reverts to the "what I did was wrong but you..." defense.
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Post by sinceifell4u on Feb 17, 2009 21:31:53 GMT -5
Does Maddie’s suggestive attitude entice viewers to believe she’s making an effort to continue a sexual relationship with David? I think the ending shows an intent on Roger Director's part to try and light the spark between the two characters again. Let's face it, the man knew the magic......and was one of the very few left who could try to recreate it. However, the entire writing staff never seemed to have a long range plan for season 5, and we got disjointed episodes that never seemed to flow. Correct me if I am wrong, but outside of Womb, and the Annie episodes...couldn't you just toss all the rest in a box, and determine which should come next? I don't feel there is any continuity in season 5...which is part of the problem. My previous comment notwithstanding, I agree--all of the "moments" that we get between them could have come in any order. I suppose it would have made the most sense to put "Take My Wife" before "Perfetc"....aah, forget it--it's too frustrating! Maybe that's why I never watch any of the S5 episodes in order...hadn't thought about that before.
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Post by lin212 on Feb 17, 2009 21:33:27 GMT -5
Getting back to Roger Director, the scenes in Maddie's office when they are arguing about taking the case are classic. The banter is reminiscent of episodes past, the sparks are flying ("I come from a long line of missionaries"), the "in your face" dialog and the little kiss that David throws to Maddie are great. Not part of this scene, but another one of my other favorite lines - "Penetration - they allow that on TV?" Gotta love it.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Feb 17, 2009 21:38:24 GMT -5
Golly Lin...you made even ME blush!
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Post by sinceifell4u on Feb 17, 2009 21:40:52 GMT -5
10. The final question is…in the last scene, Maddie presents David with paper work for the partnership buy-in. Does Maddie’s suggestive attitude entice viewers to believe she’s making an effort to continue a sexual relationship with David?Although I generated this question, I wasn't really gonna touch it, but the responses about S5's lack of continuity prompts me forth. I'm with Gray and everyone else that had some hope with this "bread crumb". Roger did a fabulous job and really should have written (at least after this one) all the episodes consistently. The constant ups and downs of S5 took it's toll on the viewers (especially after the S4 delays). I must say, I can find something I like about each of the S5 episodes (well maybe not the ones with Annie, no, definitely not the ones with Annie). It seems like everybody jumped ship in this season and left Camelot to fend for itself.
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Post by sinceifell4u on Feb 17, 2009 21:43:28 GMT -5
Getting back to Roger Director, the scenes in Maddie's office when they are arguing about taking the case are classic. The banter is reminiscent of episodes past, the sparks are flying ("I come from a long line of missionaries"), the "in your face" dialog and the little kiss that David throws to Maddie are great. Not part of this scene, but another one of my other favorite lines - "Penetration - they allow that on TV?" Gotta love it. LOL, yes and yes, OMG...ah to reminisce about the ML of old.
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Post by lin212 on Feb 17, 2009 21:47:34 GMT -5
Golly Lin...you made even ME blush! gray, I can't stop laughing. Now I've really got a case of the giggles! Btw, the censors didn't seem to have a problem with it. Couldn't be so bad, then.
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Post by MoonBeemer on Feb 17, 2009 21:57:03 GMT -5
4. Do David and Maddie really go too far to prove a point to each other? If so, how?
5. This is a 2 part’er. A. About half way through the episode, David calls a “cease fire” between the Wobblies, yet not with Maddie… Why is this?B. David, after declaring the cease fire, goes directly into Maddie’s office proposing dinner yet trying to read her regarding the case {sneaky devil}. Do you feel Maddie would have resorted to what happens in the next scene if David had not gone into her office? Why or why not?6. The “Pink Panther” scene is a great one for Maddie, one of my favorites. Taking your considerations from the previous question: Did David set a trap for Maddie, knowing she’d do anything to beat him? Do you think David is truly surprised at Maddie for going “beneath” him or does he see it coming?
7. What do you think of the Pink Panther scene in general? What does this say about Maddie’s mental growth or demise (lol) from the prior 4 seasons?
In addition to knowing when to let dog's lay, I think David calls the ceasefire for the greater good of Wobblie cohesion, plus it wasn't worth sacrifing to the love of two particular sets of people. In that light, while I believe he was confident of Team Shirts' chances for victory, I don't believe that his intent was to flaunt it when he extended the cease fire olive branch to Maddie with his dinner invitation. But when he found Maddie unreceptive and with her nose still to the grind, he smelled blood and his inner shark couldn’t help but circle the wagon. I think that exchange inadvertently precipitated Maddie’s “Pink Panther” stunt, but I doubt he went into the conversation with such a deliberate and elaborate setup in mind. Couple things of note here: Although partners, David & Maddie have always been a bit competitive with each other. To me, Maddie occassionally came off conceited and condescending to him throughout the series, so it was an interesting twist to see her taking a more David-like approach and him being the one admonishing her for her questionable behavior for a change(even though his measures were technically more highly illegal than hers). For the record, can't see early series Maddie resorting to such a dirty maneuver (both figuratively & literally!), which is a testament to how much David has rubbed off on her (again, both figuratively & literally)...moving on...
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Post by sinceifell4u on Feb 17, 2009 22:09:24 GMT -5
I don't believe that his intent was to flaunt it when he extended the cease fire olive branch to Maddie with his dinner invitation. But when found Maddie was not receptive and still had her nose to the grind, he smelled blood and his inner shark couldn’t help but circle the wagon. I think that exchange inadvertently precipitated Maddie’s “Pink Panther” stunt, but I doubt he went into the conversation with such an elaborate setup in mind. That is a great break down...his initial intention may have been to settle up but when he recognized her vulnerability, he jumped right back to the plan, lol...good one Moonbeemer For the record, can't see early series Maddie resorting to such a dirty maneuver (both figuratively & literally!), which is a testament to how much David has rubbed off on her (again, both figuratively & literally)...moving on... Maddie definitely has either grown (in David's eyes) or has lowered her standards (in her own eyes)...which ever, it was the progressive change that you would assume she would have taken over time. His personality smears on hers like creamy peanut butter.
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Post by lin212 on Feb 17, 2009 22:12:43 GMT -5
Does Maddie's suggestive attitude entice viewers to believe she's making an effort to continue a sexual relationship with David?
Agree that this scene is an attempt to light the spark and David must think so too judging by the smile on his face as we freeze frame. So frustrating that these little crumbs lead nowhere.
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graycav56
3rd Level
I can't imagine not rewatching with you next week.
Posts: 948
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Post by graycav56 on Feb 17, 2009 22:13:28 GMT -5
This is definitely off topic, but I just saw a trailer for next week's episode of 24. There is a slapping scene in the preview that definitely reminds me of D&M. See for yourself. www.youtube.com/watch?v=6u90cQCKHV4
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Post by MoonBeemer on Feb 17, 2009 22:42:28 GMT -5
Since, thanks for these thought-provoking questions...and BTW, love the new signature! David's look when he says "peon" is just priceless! Hope it's ok that I'm jumping in a bit early...it happens to be momentarily quiet around these here parts... 1. At the beginning of the episode, Bert is supportive of Agnes’ attitude towards MacGillicudy’s request for Jamie to “freshen” his coffee. What transpires that changes Bert’s attitude? Is this change genuine? I think Bert is prompted to do an apparent about-face for two reasons: MacGillicudy's crack about "who wears the panties"; and more importantly, his respect for (OK, idolization of) David. Bertie loves to feel like he's David's right-hand guy, and if Coach Addison needs the support of his "shirts," Bert's gonna be right in there, hacking into computer systems and making game-time speeches. As far as the "change" being genuine, I'm not sure there really is a change. Bert's support of Agnes seems to exist side-by-side with a desire to be "one of the guys"--and not just in this episode. Bert is part of the conclaves in David's office, whether it's gawking over the McClafferty photos (OK, I guess he's asleep there, but he had already had his eyeful...and more) or calling 976 numbers. Perhaps Bert's response to MacGillicudy in that scene is largely about the competition/dislike between the two men--Bert doesn't want to miss an opportunity to look like the Better Guy in Agnes' eyes. Can't say it any better than that! Bert really is a balancing act type of guy. He does tend to overdue it a tad when it comes to power & status, which I think further explains his slavedriving mentality and desire to fit in with David (and Maddie too, recalling "Womb..."), another possible source of his hornlocking with MacGillicuddy, whom he probably sees as his main competition to the Blue Moon throne as well as Agnes - both separate but not entirely unrelated issues.
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Post by rose35 on Feb 17, 2009 23:16:31 GMT -5
1. At the beginning of the episode, Bert is supportive of Agnes’ attitude towards MacGillicudy’s request for Jamie to “freshen” his coffee. What transpires that changes Bert’s attitude? Is this change genuine? I think the reason why it works is because Agnes knows and understands Bert. She gets that he is a strange little guy with a big mouth who aspires to be David's loyal sidekick, and constantly practices oneupmanship on the other guys in the office. She knows that his act is full of baloney, but that he has a huge heart, and probably doesn't mean half of what he says to fit in. She accepts him -- quirks, flaws, faults -- and lets him have his office persona because she knows the real guy who will be coming home to her at the end of the day. Quite the antithesis of our other twosome. Great description here Diane! I will say that Bert likes to be part of the game in a way, he wants to be taken seriously ,he wants to be Davids right hand man for sure! he can play dirty when he has to but like its been said hes a cute huggable sweet loving guy that loves Agnes alot . So he trys to be both types of that guy.
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Post by rose35 on Feb 17, 2009 23:35:11 GMT -5
A. About half way through the episode, David calls a “cease fire” between the Wobblies, yet not with Maddie… Why is this?B. David, after declaring the cease fire, goes directly into Maddie’s office proposing dinner yet trying to read her regarding the case {sneaky devil}. Do you feel Maddie would have resorted to what happens in the next scene if David had not gone into her office? Why or why not?/quote] In addition to knowing when to let dog's lay, I think David calls the ceasefire for the greater good of Wobblie cohesion, plus it wasn't worth sacrifing to the love of two particular sets of people. In that light, while I believe he was confident of Team Shirts' chances for victory, I don't believe that his intent was to flaunt it when he extended the cease fire olive branch to Maddie with his dinner invitation. But when he found Maddie unreceptive and with her nose still to the grind, he smelled blood and his inner shark couldn’t help but circle the wagon. I think that exchange inadvertently precipitated Maddie’s “Pink Panther” stunt, but I doubt he went into the conversation with such a deliberate and elaborate setup in mind. Couple things of note here: Although partners, David & Maddie have always been a bit competitive with each other. To me, Maddie occassionally came off conceited and condescending to him throughout the series, so it was an interesting twist to see her taking a more David-like approach and him being the one admonishing her for her questionable behavior for a change(even though his measures were technically more highly illegal than hers). For the record, can't see early series Maddie resorting to such a dirty maneuver (both figuratively & literally!), which is a testament to how much David has rubbed off on her (again, both figuratively & literally)...moving on... Oh another great post here Moonbeemer! you guys really have posted some great stuff tonight! I believe David hated having the office basically split in half over this case, he likes the family feel of the office and well when he realized it was enough time he called the truce or cease fire I always felt David going into Maddies office was so genuine when he first starts talking and asks her to dinner, its another one of those David feeling Maddie out to see how she feels about him moments in season 5 ,well she shot him down everytime Of course i think that kinda wounds him each time and well he of course started talking about how sure he was he had the case settled in his mind already and once he got going Maddie sure wasnt happy that David may win over her. JUst adding to say that Cybill looked AMAZING sitting on the couch in this scene! SO SEXY Darn Maddie for not saying yes to dinner! maybe it would have turned out different if she just said yes once! Ok dreaming alittle here
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